Quote Originally Posted by keith_r
wow.. you really are close minded.. you found what info you wanted to find..
That's hypocritical though... because you haven't stated anything about sodium ferrocyanide... you basically just want me to assume it's bad for you and me and the fish just because YOU SAY SO? This is EXACTLY what I'm talking about. What makes you the authority on anything and everything? Post some references for God's sake. Moreover, I do not just find information to suit my needs... If I was hasteful in my research, it was because I felt that my minimal research outweighed your nonexistent research! Anyway, it is mind boggling you would say that after all my thorough posts... perhaps you can find a reason to why you said that within yourself! You can question my research or my information in any way you like, but don't question my character irrespective to how I conduct myself as evident on this forum.

Quote Originally Posted by keith_r
there are several anti caking agents that can be used for salt.. Sodium ferrocyanide (as an example) will break down in sunlight to cyanide.. certainly harmful to fish.. many contain copper, that can be bad for plants.. some may be ok.. but again, why take the chance? use pure salt and avoid the risk, that's not trying to scare anyone, it's presenting facts...
good luck with your garden uf
fertilizers in the garden are a great thing.. but when there are fish in the mix (you seem to ignore that fact in many of your discussions) the equations change..
oh, and i'm not a "hippy", but name calling always helps an me win an argument too!
You keep posting information as if they are words that poured out of God's mouth!!! OKAY?!? So, I was a bit upset when I posted that, and in retrospect I feel I went a bit too far calling you a hippy. SO SORRY! I will replace it with FOLKLORE.

I admit I don't know as much on the aquacultural side as I do on the botanical side of things (I just ordered books from the library, most of which are to remedy this exact problem, LOL)... however, I try to state SPECIFIC information or research that discusses EXACT CONCENTRATIONS OF TOXICITY LEVELS whereas you do not even attempt to provide ANY information... I realize that a lot of times you are presenting "commonly accepted" information from the aquaponics community or in some cases it may seem I am wrong because you may have a limit to your own knowledge (especially since a bulk of it may be anecdotal), but that is one of the reasons I speak up... I'm not asking you to BELIEVE me, I am asking you to sort through the VAST AMOUNTS OF SCIENTIFIC INFORMATION out there and see FOR YOURSELF.

How many books, research papers, dissertations, articles have you read in the pursuit of more knowledge in aquaponics? Dozens? Hundreds? Thousands? I have. I am dedicating my career to aquaponics (well aquaponics is integrally tied to my real goal which is saving lives). I am going back to school for a Masters in Environmental Science, WATER AND SOIL, with an emphasis on sustainability. After that it's either med school or pharmaceutical school (I still have time to make a final decision, partially determined by my MCAT/PCAT scores). I think you see where I am going with this...

I have a lot of love for this community, and I consider it my home. There are many aquaponic communities out there, but since this is mine I have as much pride in it as I do myself. I don't care what all the other folklore based communities have to say, I want everyone here to have the Truth about aquaponics. If you don't want to hold hands down this bumpy road, then so be it.

BACK TO THE SALT...

First, I just want to reiterate that my last post showed the most commonly used anticaking agent is in fact a simple and safe fertilizer.

I'm not sure on the accuracy of this website, but it shows foods associated with additives, and it shows that additive is not even used today. http://www.additivesinfood.info/

This paper explains the additive in detail. As someone that understands something about chemistry, I can only say that cyanide and this chemical are unbelievably different. Why anyone would assume they would behave the same in metabolic pathways in either fish, humans, or plants without a shred of evidence is beyond me... the paper below implies this as well.
on the safety of Sodium ferrocyanide user as anticaking agents (European Commission)

Human Health Effects & Human Toxicity Excerpts (MORE OF MY MUMBO JUMBO SCIENCEY STUFF):
SEVERAL GRAMS HAVE BEEN SWALLOWED REPEATEDLY BY WOULD-BE SUICIDES WITHOUT APPARENT ILL-EFFECT.
[The Merck Index: An Encyclopedia of Chemicals and Drugs 8th ed. Rahway, New Jersey: Merck and Co., Inc., 1968., p. 958] **PEER REVIEWED**

BECAUSE OF STRONG CHEMICAL BONDAGE BETWEEEN THE CYANIDE GROUP & THE IRON, FERROCYANIDES HAVE A LOW ORDER OF TOXICITY. LOW=CAUSES READILY REVERSIBLE TISSUE CHANGES WHICH DISAPPEAR AFTER EXPOSURE STOPS. CAUSES SOME DISCOMFORT.
[The Merck Index. 9th ed. Rahway, New Jersey: Merck & Co., Inc., 1976., p. 1114] **PEER REVIEWED**

SUMMARY TOXICITY STATEMENT; ACUTE... FERROCYANIDES AS SUCH ARE OF LOW ORDER OF TOXICITY. LOW=CAUSES READILY REVERSIBLE TISSUE CHANGES WHICH DISAPPEAR AFTER EXPOSURE STOPS. CAUSES SOME DISCOMFORT.
[Sax, N.I. Dangerous Properties of Industrial Materials. 5th ed. New York: Van Nostrand Rheinhold, 1979., p. 367] **PEER REVIEWED**

Reported Fatal Dose:
3(?). 3= MODERATELY TOXIC: PROBABLE ORAL LETHAL DOSE (HUMAN) 0.5-5 G/KG; BETWEEN 1 OZ & 1 PINT (OR LB) FOR 70 KG PERSON (150 LB). NO ADEQUATE TOXICITY DATA WERE LOCATED, BUT APPARENTLY THE SODIUM & POTASSIUM SALTS ARE COMPARATIVELY BENIGN. THEY ARE NOT DECOMP'ED TO CYANIDE.
[Gosselin, R.E., H.C. Hodge, R.P. Smith, and M.N. Gleason. Clinical Toxicology of Commercial Products. 4th ed. Baltimore: Williams and Wilkins, 1976., p. II-97] **PEER REVIEWED**

ADDRESSING THE STIGMA (feelings of fear not based in reason or science):
Lastly, I want to point out that cyanide is made of 1 carbon atom and 1 nitrogen atom. Again, the chemical combination is entirely relevant, but these are 2 chemical elements we find in vast quantities in our systems already. Is the fear from the word CYANIDE? Please, if you have ANY information to share, SHARE IT. If I am wrong, SO BE IT. I want the Truth, but if you can't support your claims it's nothing more than FOLKLORE. GET THAT CRAP OUT OF HERE.

I like you very much, and I wish you to continue posting in any manner you choose. Just please don't spread the folklore to our NEW members. It's twice as much work to re-teach them later, and you know someone will have the pleasure of that discomfort. Regardless, you CHALLENGE ME TO LEARN, and for that, I like you very very much. (sincerely)