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Thread: Information

  1. #1
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    Information

    Well congrats on the Forum and good luck.
    I have found that the bacteria do infact live well below the temps you state. I'm raising a cold water fish (Yellow Perch) and everything works just fine even down to freezing.
    So the need to keep temps in the 60's or so is not the case.


    Keep your fish wet and your floors dry!

  2. #2
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    Re: Information

    Welcome to the forum Waterrancher,

    Please let me express my appreciation for your willingness to participate in the forum with your post. It's always great to hear a success story.

    I, as I'm sure others interested in aquaponics, would also, greatly appreciate it if you would take it one step further for the benefit of others who visit the forum and also post how your system in which you raise the perch is setup; what it consists of as to type of medium used to clean the fish water, size of the tank in which you raise the perch, the approximate ratio of fish to the volume of water you house them in and the frequency of pumping the water to the bio-filter. Please be specific as to volume of water per minute pumped to the bio-filter and how it is returned to the fish.

    It would also be a great benefit to all if you would include details on how your hydroponic system is setup and what veggies, herbs or other plants you raise in your aquaponics system.

    Again, thank you for your informative post.
    JCO
    Irish eyes are always smiling but
    • "In the eyes of the world, you are only as good as your last success"
    so never forget
    • "MAN IS ONLY LIMITED BY HIS IMAGINATION"

  3. #3
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    Re: Information

    I'm not trying to be a "BUTTINSKY", however the header said "SPEAK UP" so I am. I agree with the "WATERRANCHER" about cold water fish and the bacteria. But, and there is always a "but", I have read every page of what is currently shown on DIYaquaponics.com and I am assuming you are referring to this paragraph under the header of "Backyard"

    Aquaponic systems work much better if a constant water temperature is maintained as beneficial bacterial species that convert ammonia to nitrate have a temperature range between 70o F and 86o F at which they operate at maximum efficiency. At temperatures below 64.4o F, a bio-filter's efficiency is lost and ammonia spikes can occur. You should always strive to try maintain a water temperatures at or above 64.4o F in the winter though it should be at least a minimum of 70o F for certain species of fish to survive, Tilapia in particular.
    If you will notice, the author does not state that the bacteria do not do what bacteria do when the water is at or below 64.4o F, but that their efficiency is lost (as comparable to optimum) at colder temperatures. Also that ammonia spikes could occur at these temperatures and this is also true.

    Let's face it, the bacteria do not have as much to do under colder conditions as they do in optimum conditions. Under cold or freezing water conditions, the fish are not as active nor are they eating as much, therefore they do no produce as much waste and other byproducts, etc, hence the bacteria's reduced ability to handle these byproducts is still sufficient to get the job done.

    Would you not agree that a temperature range between 70o F and 86o F is the optimum for both fish and bacteria?

  4. #4
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    Re: Information

    Spose Im a bit prejudgemental in that what is advised seems to be everyone should be raising Taliapia. Why go there? Many other fish can be raised with Aquaponics that will not require keeping the water heated (a major cost) for their survival. The bacteria will surive colder temps, crops can be grown in lower temps, fish will survive lower temps, this belief that everything most be kept in the tropical temp range just is not so.
    Sure most fish grow faster, eat more, etc in higher temps, but if we are going to be chasing this dream that AP is the solution to water shortages and the worlds food supply perhaps we should realise its not so bad to go with nature instead of fight it.
    I have taken my small, housed in a green house system, to the burr several times with no adverse affect on anything other then a few plants.
    Being in the Midwest of the U.S. its futile to fight the winters for 6 months and attempt to grow a tropic fish in any great numbers. Much more benificial to just keep the temps up enough for the plants to grow, take advantage of a native species for your fish.
    So in essence seek balance for your geographical area, we are not limited by a set range of temps and I would suggest that be realized because many doors will be closed for folks if they come to believe its unrealistic in there area due to temps below 60 whatever.
    We can grow fish and bacteria to filter the fish waste in the burr, natures funny way of maintaining a relationship.
    Did I make my point?

    Keep your fish wet and your floors dry!

  5. #5
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    Re: Information

    Waterrancher,

    I have to admit I donít know much at all about your Yellow Perch, however I have raised a couple of different species of Tilapia in aquariums and outdoor tanks for a number of years and I think that all the hoop-la about Tilapia is because there ďAREĒ so many species, the hybridnizing of which is limitless.

    I have read somewhere on the net that if optimum conditions were met and maintained, a pair could be induced to breed as much as 10 times per year.

    It is unfortunate they are not a cold water fish, but it would be impossible for all things to be perfect, life would be too easy, wouldnít you say

    You speak of such cold winters and being from the Midwest of the US, what state do you live in? I live in Texas near Laredo. On a clear day, I can see Mexico! Some times it feels as though I see Mexico regardless of which direction I look. No insult intended toward the people of Mexico, at least those that come here legally.

  6. #6
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    Re: Information

    Crawdad,
    I do not agree with inducing things to breed ie. hormone injection etc. I'm more in line with letting Nature do the work. The design is better then anything mankind could come up with, as it has stood the test of time. Problems arise when mankind has attempted to control the design.

    Fine that a fish can be coaxed to breed 10 times a year.
    How many fry do they release each time?
    Yellow Perch release egg strands of 25,000- 35,000 once a year. Although I have never counted myself.
    In all fairness its all in the perspective, you could have a fish that needs stringent temp controls producing 10 times a year, I cant emagine each breeding would produce much more then 300 fry at a wack. So even giving that as a best number that is 3,000 babies a year.
    In comparison YP offspring would be ten times that number.
    Of course there has been no discussion on breeding the offspring to up the numbers or of survivability rate nor the kind of stress it causes to produce offspring nearly every month.
    I would be plumb wore out.

  7. #7
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    Re: Information

    Hey Waterrancher,

    Donít get me wrong. I wasnít saying that I agreed with the drug induced hybridnization of Tilapia, only that it was going on and did present some interesting strains which were able to produce more weight in less time. Iím talking about cross breeding not drugs. If it were not for cross breeding, we would not have the large selection of live stock and poultry that we have today, but I draw the line at drugs.

    Yellow Perch may be able to produce 25 to 35,000 eggs per year, but do you have the facilities to breed them and even if only half of them hatch, do you have the facilities to house 12,500 to 17,500 YP? The advantage of the Tilapia, though the egg production depends on the size of the female, it can actually be anywhere from 100 to 1,500 per spawning. See this link:

    http://books.google.com/books?id=E_eu9E ... _JKKjSGxGA

    This can allow a person to breed and cross breed their own stock without having to buy the fingerlings from anyone and if controlled properly, he can produce the fry when needed so as to have a continual flow of fingerlings when needed to be able to restock as many tank/ponds as desired.

    Nothing says that a persons has to induce spawning of a single pair of Tilapia to 10 times per year, however the fact that spawning can be induced more or less at will, then with the right number of trios (one male, two females) a person could insure they have the fry they need when they want them.

    Just another point of view.

  8. #8
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    Re: Information

    Trust me, I wrote such a long and brilliant response that the forum timed out on me and it was lost in the ones and zeros that are the internet!
    Ohh well

  9. #9
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    Re: Information

    Don't get me wrong, the discussion is worth the effort. Just so much can be written at a time.

  10. #10
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    Re: Information

    Waterrancher,

    I guess you could say I'm on the sneaky side. I learned a long time ago to create all my posts in MS Word (it checks my spelling ) and then copy it to the forum. That way, no lost thoughts or typing labor

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