The new school system...

[GreenPhoenix]

OK, so I have some news to tell and also I find myself in need of help from the all of the people on this forum. A little background on me - I am a high school teacher of Biology, Environmental Science, and Physics as a mid-size private school in Dallas, TX. Since I started at this school, I have been working to convince my superiors that the creation of an comprehensive Aquaponics program would be a great thing for our students...

Well I just got the work yesterday that we are moving forward with this. So here is the deal, I have support from all appropriate parties. We are now at the phase where the formal proposal needs to be written and presented to the Board of Directors. While I have explained the concept fully to the people I have talked to, it seems that the Board is going to want a written formal proposal that includes a budget, site design schematic and usage plan. Well I have the usage plan completed, I have been told to "shoot the moon" in my proposed budget.... Meaning I am going to write this as if money is no object. (Well in truth, maybe as if it were a small relatively minor object.)

So here is where I need your help -- I need some help designing this system. I will be the first to admit that I am very much a newcomer to the whole idea of AP. I have a basic working idea of how things go together and what they will encompass for a large system... But as the school will want this pretty much designed to the hilt BEFORE it is built, I currently find myself out of my element.

Current Constraints:

Total Space designated for the program: 20 ' x 20' (it will be on top of a concrete slab - a.k.a a portion of the school parking lot)
Proposed Greenhouse: 14' wide x 10' tall x 16' long (Single door in middle of the 14' side)

I would like to have the entire system inside the greenhouse, but it might be possibly to have an external fish tank. The difficulty with that is that temps will get down to the low 30's F on a regular basis and below freezing is quite common for short periods of time... Another difficulty is that I need this to be a TEACHING space. That means that I need to be able to get at least 10, but preferably 20 students inside this greenhouse at a time.

We will be raising tilapia and basic vegetables / herbs. All produce raised will be donated / sold in order to provide food and monies to local charities. We currently plan to breed our own tilapia inside the school in another system... (Set up at a later date)

Initial questions:
1. Do I need to ask for a bigger greenhouse? With a completed system running, will I be able to have my class inside at the same time?
2. I have estimated about $5000 to build the system from scratch - I do want to use recycled/repurposed materials. But I am not opposed to buying new if needed. I would like to have a system where I can tell my kids to "MacGuyver" a solution based on materials at hand...


So here is my situation... I need your help. All designs will be considered, and all people who collaborate on this with us will be recognized in all of our materials. Thanks in advance for the help that you can give. I am going to xpost this on Practical AP and the BYAP forums to hopefully get a greater audience.

Green Phoenix

[badflash]

I would build a 20'X20' hoop house. You are going to have legal problems putting 20 students in a space that big. Unless you can provide some significant temporary heat, the tilapia are going to have issues. Heat the water, not the greenhouse.

For your budget, the barrelponics model would appear to be the best. For $5K you can build the hoophouse, and barrelponics setup. Probably 3 or 4.
http://www.fastonline.org/content/view/15/29 is the link

I would use a bell siphon rather than his barrel flush system, but it works all the same.

[jackalope]

Putting the FT outside is out of the question, considering the temps you mentioned .... putting the barrel-ponics toward the two outer/sloping edges of a hoop house would allow much more room for the students to view and learn on both sides of the center aisle, rather than 1 main FT/GB setup. With the Barrelponics, you could conceivably have about 4 systems, divide the 20 students into 4 groups, and probably get more individuals involved .... otherwise, you will have the less aggressive students taking a back seat and/or not being able to participate! Economy-wise, I think a barrel-ponics system would be much better, although I would also consider the barrel-ponics setup that ernie recommended in another post for the FT's and then some half-barrels for the GBs. If the water is heated to 80f to 85f during the winter, you shouldn't have too much trouble keeping the GH warm with 20 bodies in there

[GreenPhoenix]

Let me clarify -- the cost for the greenhouse is not included in my $5000 budget for the system. That amount is specifically for the AP system itself. AND, I was told that if that amount is not sufficient - then I should increase the amount.

The students will not be outside during winter for any extended amount of time, so other than them wearing jackets to and from the building - I don't think that heating will be an issue.

Also in terms of size and capacity issues -- what size greenhouse do you think would be necessary for me to house an AP system AND ~20 people?

Green Phoenix

[JCO]

The larger the system, the less likely of problems with the veggies and fish. Small systems require constant monitoring because the least amount of change in the number of veggies (and size) and like wise with the fish, the chemistry of the system will change drastically.

If you are going to make this a real project that will show the actual potential of aquaponics, I would suggest you make the green house as large as they will allow you space for. Working with a small system will look more like something to do for a hobby producing only small amounts of this or that veggie and fish while a large system would actually show that you are teaching technology that could feed a starving nation.

What kind of activities will the 20 students be expected/required to perform while in the greenhouse? Are you going to be trying to grow large or small amounts of various veggies? Will you be holding the actual class in the greenhouse with student seating and erasable board. These are all question that need to be answered before you can figure size for the greenhouse.

Don't forget that during the winter, it will get quite cool in the greenhouse and the summers will require considerable ventilation to keep the students from soaking their clothing with perspiration. Too bad I'm not closer, I would love to help you set it all up and get it running.

[swamp creek farms]

Another thing that you might want to think about is making a germinating spot in the greenhouse.

The local schools here propagate tomato and peppers and other local plants that are easily grown and sell the plants to the public for $1 or so.

We have an agriculture program here at our local high school, with a greenhouse they do this in. They raise money to supply their own funding for what they are learning.

Keeps the school from cutting the program. Which they do quite often here.

Maybe not what your into, but just an idea.

[mpugh5@aol.com]

Hello fella's , i agree with much that has been said here, i would suggest the green house have a small head house for germination and the heat source. that way the space in the green house will be just for the aquaponics operation. Depending on what you will use for heat, say maybe a 300 btu pool heater you can run coils under grow beds and through the fish tank, have the best of two worlds.

[JCO]

One other thing I forgot to mention..even though this is a project for the school, you...the custodian of said project...will have to be on hand seven days a week to over see its operation. Unlike a regular class room, you can't turn the lights off and close the door on Friday or Holidays and forget school until time to return. A project of this size will require attention daily.

[davidstcldfl]

JCO made a good point.
Another thing along that lines.....power shortages. If you have a 'serious systyem' going, you'll need some kind of back up.... preferably an 'auto' system....maybe 12 volt with a transformer/inverter, to run an air pump for the fish. Maybe even a small generator with auto start to run everything !

Some air pumps have the built in ability to switch to a battery.

http://www.aquaticeco.com/subcategories ... %20pumps/9

[badflash]

You can use a computer battery backup to run airpumps for quite a while. There are also systems that can call your cell phone based on temperature, water levels, etc.