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  1. #21
    Members Apollo's Avatar
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    In your last picture it appears to me that the pipe leaving the M and going to the gutter is at an uphill angle. It needs to be running down hill all the way.

    Have you increased the water flow in the GB to the point of almost overflowing your GB? I still think you need more flow into, maybe a longer center stand pipe & a downward run from your M all the way to your gutter.

    One of the way to achieve is to come off the center tee on your M with a 45<, a longer run to the end of your GB, all at a 45 degree angle. Your siphons "fire" by the use of gravity...a longer run would increase your chances.

    Before you scrape everything I would also try running the stand pipe on the M straight down & out the bottom of your GB. Than a 90< to your gutter, make sure that your tail pipe still runs downhill and a 90< on the end of the discharge pipe. Keep a 90< on the gutter end, turned at a slight upward angle.

    Don't forget about increasing your water flow into your GB's...as long as it works without overflowing it !

  2. #22
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    I've been out of town for a couple days, so this is the first chance I'm getting a look at everything. My system is all 1" pipe - some of them are angled into the FT, some are reduced to 3/4", and all seem to work OK.

    Here's a pic of how mine are set up - just a U siphon.


    Both of the drain lines on these GBs are 1" - the one with media has a 45* angle into the FT, the other has a 90* The only time the siphons will break is when they're completely out of the water.

    The water level in the FT fluctuates around 3", the longest the GBs go between cycles is about 15min.
    Jason M.

  3. #23
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    As I noted above, increasing flow only resulted in the fill time getting as low as 10 minutes. However, the drain simply accounts for this by increasing discharge to match the flow, though the reaction is a bit delayed.

    Increasing flow, and reducing the M to 1/2 inch, simply increased how much faster the barrel filled, and dramatically reduced how fast it drained. This makes the barrel over fill, and if no action is taken overflows.

    jvision --am I understanding then that you are filling with a 1 inch reduced to 3/4, and draining with a 1 inch? I am starting to think that this is where my error is. Filling and draining with 3/4 just isn't working, even with ball valves on each barrel, I simply am unable to match what is needed.

    If it drains faster, the suction will break in time due to lack of water not filling the pipe. A 1" pipe will take more water to start siphon, there by requiring the water level to be higher in the barrel before starting. Okay, that sounds more like of what I am needing. Looks like I am going to have sacrifice one barrel plug, and make yet another hardware store run for the 1 inch parts. I will start this time with a simple loop or N. And then convert to the M and compare the differences.
    At first I left this blank...but now I believe: "It's better to keep your mouth closed, and have the world think your a fool, than open it and confirm it."

  4. #24
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    None of the drains are running up hill. Except at last 90, where it can be adjusted to the various angles.
    At first I left this blank...but now I believe: "It's better to keep your mouth closed, and have the world think your a fool, than open it and confirm it."

  5. #25
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    Here's a pic that better shows how it's all set up - the u-siphon drain is surrounded by weeping tile to keep media from being sucked up. Each supply line has a ball valve - each of them are set to less than 1/2 open. Drain lines are 1" pipe as well, but have some way of choking them off a bit to help start the siphon - 3 of them are reduced to 3/4" BELOW the GB, and 2 have a 90* or 45* elbow to cause a bit of restriction.

    Jason M.

  6. #26
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    BTW, this is as full as this system gets - the siphon engages before getting more than 1/2 way up the U
    Jason M.

  7. #27
    Members Apollo's Avatar
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    Have you check out Wolfracer's System Build, this looks like it should work with your barrel setup.

    Good luck...wish I lived closer to you I would give you a hand.

  8. #28
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    Just returned from the hardware store. I will start assembling a 1" loop siphon. W/out glue. The basic loop and the M loop will be tested on the same barrel so as to only carve up one bung plug. I will post and pics when test is complete.
    At first I left this blank...but now I believe: "It's better to keep your mouth closed, and have the world think your a fool, than open it and confirm it."

  9. #29
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    1" doesn't work either. It will fire in either N or M configuration, but will not stop simply reduces flow to match intake flow. It doesn't matter if intake is wide open or a stream no bigger than that of a straw.

    Running drain pipe up hill or down hill doesn't make a difference.

    End 90 from straight down to straight up, and every angle in between makes no difference.

    Adding pipe to the end of the 90 makes no difference, except in the height of the water in the grow bed when it starts.

    My system matches apollo's design, and doesn't work. I mirrored the example above and doesn't work. The only difference is that mine comes out the side of the tub, and the example comes out the bottom.
    And if that's the problem, than I quit. I built this whole damn thing around that option. And was assured it wouldn't matter.

    AND now, sump has over flowed and I have 1,000 gallons in my back yard.
    At first I left this blank...but now I believe: "It's better to keep your mouth closed, and have the world think your a fool, than open it and confirm it."

  10. #30
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    Ok, so it's official constant flow siphons suck, bell siphons suck. What's the next option?
    At first I left this blank...but now I believe: "It's better to keep your mouth closed, and have the world think your a fool, than open it and confirm it."

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