questions

[MurCurY]

I am setting up tank #2...was offered ANOTHER tank for free
I'm thinking of using my biofilter and connecting all three tanks...In my assembling..I found people use all kinds of stuff in their filter for surface area. I have a HUGE container of hydroton...can I use this as surface area media in my biofilter?...as well as in grow pots that will also be circulating water back to the tank? I've had loose clay in my bubble buckets when I use hydroton..no problem for plants...fish?

As for food...I'm looking for suggestions for an organic food for tilapia. Are there any that are actually organic?

[davidstcldfl]

'Free tank'....

If you already have the hydroton...sure. If you want to 'save' the hydroton for your plants....and If you got the $ to buy something....I'd consider bioiballs or PVC shavings.

The 'organic feed' issue....has been kicked around a lot, on 'what it 'is' and/or should 'be'...? Some say it's OK to have 'land animals' in it for protein....others say that's not natural...it should be seafood based protein ( I guess piranhas eat cows, when they get in the water... )

Then there is the issue of using 'plants' for protein....most soybeans and 'stuff' have been....'Monsanto-ized'... ...

[MurCurY]

personally I have no issues with GMO...it is the future of farming :insert flame here:
However...I work on an organic farm with people that all eat organic..so..I plan on growing these fish as close to organic as possible. And for land proteins....seriously I could care less as long as they eat it..and they grow at decent rates, no antibiotics or hormones..and certified organic by some certifier...I can use it...

If it were me personally...I'd run all male reversed fish and grow the shit out of them!

[davidstcldfl]

personally I have no issues with GMO...it is the future of farming :insert flame here:

...WHAT ?...Dam Yankee ! :P
Just razzing you MurCurY...I'm a 'yank' too...and sometimes I use F1 crops myself.
The thing that 'curls the leaves' on my plants is....When Monsanto's frankenstein plants cross pollinate with some farmer's plants that may be heirloom. Then they turn around and sue him for 'stealing' their patent....that's just so wrong !

If it were me personally...I'd run all male reversed fish and grow the shit out of them!

...The 'fox' works at the chicken farm.....
You may consider this option...Badflash has mentioned keeping fry, in high temp water....it 'naturally' increases the 'male' count.
Maybe Badflash will chime in with the 'details' of how, when, and how long it takes....? I'd like to know more myself.

[MurCurY]

I went to school for agriculture and have education in both organic and conventional farming techniques. It's funny that there is a sector within agriculture that essentially cannot be totally organic without opening a whole new market to feed that sector. Hoping someone soon will take that plunge. While looking online...I found a link to an article that states that there is a farm in Maine that grows fish for aquaponics organically. So...I called them He told me that the article is misleading. The farm grew duckweed which they had certified organic that they then used as feed for trout. Too bad I can't grow enough duckweed to use as main feed source.

A few days ago I dipped my finger in the duckweed bucket....few plantlets stuck to my finger...I then dipped it into the glofish tank....hiding amongst the fernlike plant that is in the tank...i see a whole bunch of duckweed :GRIN:

Does duckweed require water movement or airation?...i'm thinking about putting a whole bunch in the tank so it takes hold for when the tilapia get here....

[MurCurY]

don't know if this has been posted here...but while looking for info i found this...

http://edis.ifas.ufl.edu/fa012

Life history characteristics

Age at sexual maturity (months): 5-6

Size at sexual maturity (grams): 28-350

Stocking ratio for spawning: 2-5 females to 1 male Annual spawns: 7-10 broods

Spawning success e.g. spawns/week:20-30%

Eggs/gram of fish:1-4

Survival of egg to fry (< 5 g): 70-90%

Survival of fry to fingerling (5 to 30 grams): 60-90%

Survival of fingerling to market (30 to 680 grams): 70-98%

Environmental requirements

Water Temperatures for

Optimum growth: 28-32°C

Optimum spawning and embryo development:25-30°C

Dissolved Oxygen (DO): above 3.0 mg/l

Carbon Dioxide: below 15 mg/l

Salinity: 0-28 ppt

Turbidity:25-100 mg/l

pH: 6.0-8.5

Alkalinity: 50-700 mg/l

Total Ammonia Nitrogen (TAN): 0.5-1 mg/l

Useful Unit Conversions

Temperature Relations:

°F = (°C × 1.8) + 32

°C = (°F - 32) ÷ 1.8

[urbanfarmer]

GOOD FIND MurCurY!!!

I'm still trying to understand the problems people have with GMO or at least the claims they make...

[davidstcldfl]

Does duckweed require water movement or airation?...i'm thinking about putting a whole bunch in the tank so it takes hold for when the tilapia get here....

In regards to water movement...It perfers little to none.

Here's a great pdf about ducweed....
http://www.fao.org/Ag/AGAInfo/resources ... DW/Dw2.htm


That's an interesting find MurCurY....The 28 ppt on salinity is higher then I would of thought.

[davidstcldfl]

I'm still trying to understand the problems people have with GMO or at least the claims they make...

Pandora opened the lid because she had the the gift of curiosity.
We want to open the lid on GMO's because of the gifts of knowledge and wisdom. However those gifts have been tainted by the curse of 'pride'... and his evil brother, 'greed', who lurks in the shadows

Do we 'really' think we understand the complex interaction of nature enough, to stick our fingers into it..? Let me know when someone 'creates' their 'own' matter, from 'nothing' and then creates a complex, intelligent life form from it...

Up front....the desire to have crops that resists bugs, fungus, heat, cold, ect, is a good thing. I understand that tomatoes were quite small at one time. By selecting plants with the traits we liked and saving those seeds, we came up with some wonderfully, tasty heirloom tomatoes.
However bugs and diseases like them as much as we do....and they don't ship well. So let's break out our tainted gifts....and create tasteless, some what square fruit, and gas them with chemicals till they are 'kind of' red and ship them around the world. And next year, we 'buy' more seeds to do the same.

UF, maybe you could write a paper that would calm the fears of the mexican and central america maze farmers. They have passed the same seeds down through countless generations, raising maze that grows well in it's environment with little, to no input from man.
Now, they are finding GMO corn, planted by here and there, by 'someone'.
'When' this GMO corn crosses with their heirloom seeds...no more saving their seeds to pass onto the next generation. Wow, now the maze will also have to have man made fertilizers added to it, to make it grow.
Let's see....'who' would be the 'someone' ...that would benefit from selling seed and man made fertilizers....?

You have a great concern with things like azomite, and now pvc, because you were taught in school that they have bad stuff in them (which is true). You can research the substances on line and find the info too. The info is somewhat 'black and white'....some 'scholar' has to determine what a 'safe level is'.


GMO safety is more of a 'concept'....not so much black and white 'facts'. That's what the 'makers' want you to think...that it's about facts.
Let's follow the money trail...along the path, we will find the 'tainted' gifts, given to mankind in full bloom.

[urbanfarmer]

Why would I write a paper on an issue I can't even get information on? Where's the research? Any time I try to find something tangible it always shows the opposite of the "hype" that GMO foods are safe. I actually WANT to see something credible explaining it's lack of safety, but no one can provide it. Is it that complicated of an issue or is there another reason? Strange...

Personally, I don't care about the legal aspects of GMO that's for the big farmers and big business to deal with. My question is what is the problem with GMO as far as me eating some GMO corn for example. The genetic information in the corn itself has what effect on me? I hear so many people cry about GMO, and I'm not saying their claims are incorrect for I have not heard them, but WHAT IS THE PROBLEM WITH GMO? It always sounds to me like fear and nothing more. I mean, even the people who say FLUORESCENT LIGHTS MAKE PEOPLE SICK have very delineated claims. So... what's wrong with GMO, now?

I wasn't taught anything about azomite in "school", I just used my eyeballs to read the label. Imagine picking up a bag of your favorite snack and seeing that it contained lead, arsenic, uranium, fluorine... I'm pretty sure you'd put it back down... It's really not rocket science!

I was surprised about the PVC because so many people scoff at the fact it "might" leach toxins (in fact they had a discussion on this at the conference), and then today we had a discussion in class where everyone was presenting their actual findings and experiences with it. It's one of those subjects where I blindly accepted the folklore and it was silly of me to do it, but there's so much folklore out there sometimes you don't even think to question it. I gotta step up my game I guess!

Like the azomite, the PVC toxins will accumulate in the system and in the plants and fish. You might as well drink the water because it's the same as eating some lettuce out of your system.

Not all PVC is created equal, but it's difficult at best to get the information of what the mfr put in the material. OH, this goes for PVC pond liner too (again, try to get answers from the mfr).

Remember, FEAR will always slow progress and blind you from the TRUTH. A higher education, science, or academia are not things to be feared. They exist as a method to seek TRUTH, but it's not the only method.

As Einstein said: "It would be possible to describe everything scientifically, but it would make no sense; it would be without meaning, as if you described a Beethoven symphony as a variation of wave pressure."

In other words, it would not encompass the whole TRUTH of the thing. Life is more than just science, but fear is not a part of the equation in my view of existence.