Safe Seaweed Nutrient

[wh33t]

Hey all,

So I'm having a terrible time with my fish at the moment. They keep dying. What I would like to do is remove them from my AP system, quarantine them in a nice tank and see if they still die randomly. If they do not randomly die in the quarantine tank I think it's safe for me to assume that there is something killing them inside my AP system (perhaps my pink polystyrene lids? Electrical PVC conduit pipe?). Whilst my fish are suffering my plants seem to be doing quite well. So if I remove my fish from the system, I'm under the impression my bacteria cultures that complete the nitrogen cycle will die out and my plants will not have a source of nutrient.

According to Murray Hallam, seaweed extract is a great AP friendly nutrient additive for situations just like this. I'm from Vancouver Island, BC, Canada and I don't have access to Seasol (the brand Hallam suggests) so I'm curious what other AP friendly Seaweed sources might be available to me in my area.

Also any suggestions on lid and support structure alternatives would be great.

[keith_r]

seaweed extract will add some beneficial nutrients but won't keep the nitrification process going, to do that, you can add aged humonia (pee,, aged 2 weeks, by this time it is converted to ammonia, and any pathogens likely killed off) or some other ammonia source, but you have to be careful with that..(no added foaming agents or scenting agents etc)

[wh33t]

seaweed extract will add some beneficial nutrients but won't keep the nitrification process going, to do that, you can add aged humonia (pee,, aged 2 weeks, by this time it is converted to ammonia, and any pathogens likely killed off) or some other ammonia source, but you have to be careful with that..(no added foaming agents or scenting agents etc)

Pee, aged two weeks eh ... Will my bacteria cultures survive for 2 weeks lol? Aging pee sounds like a strange thing to be doing. How much pee on average would you say it takes to put 1ppm of ammonia into a system say 10 gallons in size?

[urbanfarmer]

Hey all,

So I'm having a terrible time with my fish at the moment. They keep dying. What I would like to do is remove them from my AP system, quarantine them in a nice tank and see if they still die randomly. If they do not randomly die in the quarantine tank I think it's safe for me to assume that there is something killing them inside my AP system (perhaps my pink polystyrene lids? Electrical PVC conduit pipe?). Whilst my fish are suffering my plants seem to be doing quite well. So if I remove my fish from the system, I'm under the impression my bacteria cultures that complete the nitrogen cycle will die out and my plants will not have a source of nutrient.

According to Murray Hallam, seaweed extract is a great AP friendly nutrient additive for situations just like this. I'm from Vancouver Island, BC, Canada and I don't have access to Seasol (the brand Hallam suggests) so I'm curious what other AP friendly Seaweed sources might be available to me in my area.

Also any suggestions on lid and support structure alternatives would be great.

The bacteria will not die (I mean sure eventually they will).

Seaweed extract is fine to use temporarily. Economically, we don't consider it worth the cost. Environmentally, we are concerned we will get a salt buildup (a few weeks or a couple months is no big deal). Philosophically, we are concerned that we are not running a hydroponic system with fish, but we are running a true aquaponic system that doesn't need this kind of stuff (at least not permanently).

Feel free to use fresh pee. I'm not sure who started the myth about letting it age, but it's a bunch of hooey. What happens to urea in aqueous solutions? Ah, the mysteries of life! (Yes, it turns into ammonium right away, you silly silly folks.) Just pee directly in your system, that's what I do (saves the trouble of peeing into a container)!

“Chemical Structure of Urea in Water”, C. Lee, E. Stahlberg, G. Fitzgerald, The Journal of Physical Chemistry, 99, p 17737, 1995.

As for the pathogens, I'm not PhD in Human Pathogens, but my doctor says human pee is sterile (YES, I ASKED). He said the only real danger he can think of with pathogens in pee is if you have microbleeding (microscopic blood in your urine), which means you have some underlying health issues (I believe kidney or liver problems). So, if you're healthy and your pee comes back normal from your bi-annual physical, then pee away!

HOWEVER, a possible CYANIDE related danger of letting it sit:

Urea solutions should always be freshly prepared and used, as solutions of urea may develop a significant concentration of reactive cyanate ions upon standing.

All in all, we can successfully consider this MYTH BUSTED.

If you are on any medications, however, the metabolites of your prescriptions need to be analyzed. They may or may not build up in your system, and they may or may not have an effect on your biota.


I HOPE TCLYNX READS THIS POST! (And good luck on her lecture Saturday!!!)

NOMMY OM NOM NOM NOM

[keith_r]

urine is not "urea", but urine does contain some urea..(somewhere around 2 to 3%) and you can buy synthetic urea at stores..
from my test results when i started my system, when i "went" directly into the tank, the ammonia did not change for several days, but when i aged the urine (the ph will go way up as it ages) and added it, i detected ammonia within a couple hours...
TCLynx did some pretty extensive testing with peeponics and has it pretty well documented..

test your fresh pee for am and it will be quite low, but as it ages it defintely gets stronger

[urbanfarmer]

urine is not "urea", but urine does contain some urea..(somewhere around 2 to 3%) and you can buy synthetic urea at stores..
from my test results when i started my system, when i "went" directly into the tank, the ammonia did not change for several days, but when i aged the urine (the ph will go way up as it ages) and added it, i detected ammonia within a couple hours...
TCLynx did some pretty extensive testing with peeponics and has it pretty well documented..

test your fresh pee for am and it will be quite low, but as it ages it defintely gets stronger

Umm, yes, but where do you think the ammonia comes from? That's why I was talking about the urea, that's where it comes from...

Dilute your urine in distilled water and test for ammonia. What do you get?

When I had a peeponic system I would whiz right into the tank. If I immediately tested for ammonia it was OFF THE CHARTS. I would of course test before, after, and at set hourly intervals. This was an adhoc experiment of sorts. It needs WATER MOLECULES to rip it apart. Try it.

Also, strangely in the peeponic system, no matter how much pee I added, it would almost completely drop the ammonia to 0 in 24 hours. There would of course be lots of nitrite and nitrate. Also, the plants had unbelievable growth, it was absurd.

[wh33t]

urine is not "urea", but urine does contain some urea..(somewhere around 2 to 3%) and you can buy synthetic urea at stores..
from my test results when i started my system, when i "went" directly into the tank, the ammonia did not change for several days, but when i aged the urine (the ph will go way up as it ages) and added it, i detected ammonia within a couple hours...
TCLynx did some pretty extensive testing with peeponics and has it pretty well documented..

test your fresh pee for am and it will be quite low, but as it ages it defintely gets stronger

Umm, yes, but where do you think the ammonia comes from? That's why I was talking about the urea, that's where it comes from...

Dilute your urine in distilled water and test for ammonia. What do you get?

When I had a peeponic system I would whiz right into the tank. If I immediately tested for ammonia it was OFF THE CHARTS. I would of course test before, after, and at set hourly intervals. This was an adhoc experiment of sorts. It needs WATER MOLECULES to rip it apart. Try it.

Also, strangely in the peeponic system, no matter how much pee I added, it would almost completely drop the ammonia to 0 in 24 hours. There would of course be lots of nitrite and nitrate. Also, the plants had unbelievable growth, it was absurd.

How do fish react to getting pee'd on lol?

[keith_r]

i used urine to cycle the system prior to adding any fish..
once fish are in the tank, the are making the ammonia

[urbanfarmer]

How do fish react to getting pee'd on lol?

I think they like it!