Commercial setups & how their plants are mounted

[Aquamon]

Every time I look at large scale aquaponics setups it looks like they are using some other technique to supply the plants with nutrients other than a ebb/flow with clay balls. For a quick example and for anyone who missed it this was on MSNBS a few nights ago. Short but fun coverage for aquaponics.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/21134540/vp ... 6#40203746 (http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/21134540/vp/40203746#40203746)

They load the lettuce into a tray and put them into their grow beds. Now do you think they flood those grow beds once an hour to feed the plants? Do you think they are using sprayers as a nutrient film technique (NFT), do you think they are doing deep water culture where the bed is continuously flooded and they are continuously pumping air into the water to provide o2 to the roots?

Maybe a DIY aquaponics place isn't where I should be looking. I really want to study commercial setups.

Thanks Guys.

[Aquamon]

Did I mention I'm a moron and didn't look in the COMMERCIAL section? I'm searching that forum now. Shoot some knowledge over anyhow if you've got something to say.

[keith_r]

from what i've seen (and there has not been much), a couple of "commercial" systems operate using dwc, but that really limits what you can grow (at least thats what i think)

growing power is i think using a combination of dwc and flood and drain.. i haven't checked out their website lately though

sweet water (the company they talked to in that news segment) got setup assistance from growing power, and i think they are using just dwc, but not positive

i was invited to a "seminar" from company that stated they have been doing ap since the 70's but they don't show any examples of what they did, and the guy running the "seminar" never tests water, says unlined galvanized tanks are fine (they might be for a couple years, but then you'll start getting zinc toxicity problems..),, turns out they are just selling "systems" and they won't really talk to you unless you are ready to spend 6 figures (yeah, over a 100g)

to many companies promising to much b.s. is going to set back ap (i think) if people listen to these hucksters and try to use their systems, they will be dissappointed

[urbanfarmer]

All these options have been explored in detail.

Depending on the size of the commercial operation you are trying to set up, you can try any system. As you know, a profitable business depends on a profitable business model; so, write up a well constructed business plan and you will make money regardless of what aquaponic implementation you use.

[davidstcldfl]

i was invited to a "seminar" from company that stated they have been doing ap since the 70's but they don't show any examples of what they did, and the guy running the "seminar" never tests water, says unlined galvanized tanks are fine (they might be for a couple years, but then you'll start getting zinc toxicity problems..),, turns out they are just selling "systems" and they won't really talk to you unless you are ready to spend 6 figures (yeah, over a 100g)

to many companies promising to much b.s. is going to set back ap (i think) if people listen to these hucksters and try to use their systems, they will be dissappointed

Your right Keith !
At the forum 'down under', they have a thread, where people post the links to guys like you were talking about. In fact, I'm pretty sure Rupert and the others tore this guy up.... :lol:

[rfeiller]

you have to remember that they are not going to give you all the information free that cost them thousands to develop. yet people seem to thin they are entitled.

[badflash]

Commercial means to make money, not necessarily be efficient or environmentally friendly, or simple. Most of these places just grow greens. Green will grow on rafts just fine and need no substrate.

They discard the fish solids, or de-water them and compost them for use in dirt farming. Like others have said, if you want to be self sufficient, do it with gravel. You can raft too for greens, but you can't live on greens.

[rfeiller]

What about the ntf systems, they seem to work for tocmatos, peppers and squash?

[keith_r]

you have to remember that they are not going to give you all the information free that cost them thousands to develop. yet people seem to thin they are entitled.

i understand that, but to make baseless claims that they can't back up.. well, it just seems a little disengenous to me, they're just out to make a buck, and in the long run, there are some companies out there that are trying to sell stuff with no real world experience in ap... good luck to them
there's a guy on the other site from the states, his handle is n8, he's come up with some pretty cool stuff and has shown his progress,, yeah, he's got proprietary equipment that he's trying to market, but he's not a dick about it.. he actually shows whats going on
oh, and i posted about this on the other site, and yeah, they were ripped pretty well..like any business venture, you'll find legit stuff, and you'll find people trying to make a buck,, all i say is that if you want to claim your system can raise so much fish/veg.. then show me

[urbanfarmer]

With all due respect, anyone trying to buy a "business-in-a-box" needs to do more research. I'm not sure what the purchase comes with, but I doubt it comes with a detailed plan explaining the ROI on the equipment purchase. SURE, you need to be able to grow your product in order to have sales, but does it make sense financially? That should be your first question in a commercial operation.

Once you have answered that, you can examine different OPTIONS for getting started. You can build it yourself, hire contractors to build it, or purchase some pre-made junk! :mrgreen:

If you REALLY want to study commercial setups, start writing a business plan. Obviously, the aquaponic implementation will be vital to analyzing your business feasibility. It's a long process, but try to have fun with it. As they say, it takes 5 hours to sharpen the axe and only 5 minutes to chop it down. Do it right the first time! ;)

Some videos to get you started. I think you want to SEE some commercial systems, but it's far more involved than choosing the right system; I assure you.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v9zHtgEsT-c
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W7wqpR8IiFc

[badflash]

Business plans are designed to fool bankers to loan you money. They have little or nothing to do with the ultimate success of the endeavor. If you tell them you are doing something new or risky, they say NO!!!. Sound science and hard work is what makes the difference.

Check out Fedex, Microsoft, Genentech, etc.

[urbanfarmer]

I think in general, anyone taking on a business endeavor has already made the assumption of working hard to get what they want; however, I do not deny that it is an integral part of a successful business! :mrgreen:

Also, I make no claims that a sound business plan will magically create business success. The paper you write it on is just paper, but the wisdom it affords its writer is priceless (or in some cases quantifiable in retrospect, LOL). However, I doubt anyone would argue that following the process of writing a business plan, which includes market research, analyzing your business, and familiarizing yourself with the ins-and-outs of the business you plan to get into, help minimize failure. The long held belief is that 50 percent of businesses fail in the first year and 95 percent fail within three years. Typically, people run out of capital long before they figure out what they are doing, and that's where the business plan comes in... to plan your business!

For instance, if someone buys equipment on credit and intends to make enough to pay the payments, their living expenses, and re-investing into growth, yet finds them-self unable to make ends meet for 1-2 years due to a lack of knowledge... well, that's about how it goes for most failed businesses. Identifying markets to sell to is the biggest problem most small aquaponic farms have, and I believe someone posted a recent article about those exact problems in Hawai'i. If you build it, they will come... not necessarily!!!

It even gets more complicated from there. What are your goals to mark success? $100,000 annual gross revenue or $1 million? What do you do once you get there, keep farming? Perhaps you plan to sell shares and create a board to manage your company more autonomously or perhaps you plan to sell it once you hit those revenues for X amount of dollars? Or, perhaps you are happy making as much or more as your old job as long as you can feed the family? These are questions that get answered when writing a business plan.



The general who wins the battle makes many calculations in his temple before the battle is fought. The general who loses makes but few calculations beforehand.
--Sun Tzu

Victorious warriors win first and then go to war, while defeated warriors go to war first and then seek to win.
--Sun Tzu


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[rfeiller]

Excellent post urbanfarmer.