Insulated Wood Tanks Anyone?

[mommyhen42]

Hi all, I guess I am back for a while... :D

As some of you may remember I live in Riverside California, Zone 10-11
Last year I set up a 400 tub tank in my aviary but it was a bust because I just could not afford to properly heat the thing and still make Tilapia a reasonable option, Thus I lost most of what was in that tank over the winter and resorted to smaller tanks, tubs that were easier to heat, but the problem there is that the fish are stunted and do not really get large enough to harvest unless I only have a very few in the tanks...
So this year I bought some channel and mud catfish and some bluegill for that tub and a 900 gal pool. But I still want to raise tilapia due to their easy reproduction vs the other species.

Thus I am considering building an insulated wood tank (or two) for the aviary building and greenhouse for raising tilapia during the winter months. I have seen various plans online for wooden tanks, so I know it can be done, and I will not plan for a front glass but rather an observation port in the top of the tank in front of the grow bed that will be situated on the top of the tank, This will be in the access door to facilitate removal of dead fish, harvesting fish, removing any fry, etc. I plan on having a fry tub on either end inside the primary tank which will actually be an area that is seperated by screen so that the fry can enter and eventually be unable to leave as they grow.

I have a source of recycled styrene sheets for the insulation between the inner tank and the outer enclosure (that will just look like a wooden storage chest).
Anyone do anything like this?
I

[badflash]

Welcome back!
I have not done this myself, but I've seen it done by some of the members here. I'm sure they will pipe up.

[wolfracer]

Welcome back!

[badflash]

Yep, I knew I saw these someplace:
Dave's ground breaking news. (http://www.diyaquaponics.com/forum/showthread.php?224-Dave-s-ground-breaking-news)

Looks like what you want.

[davidstcldfl]

Hi mommyhen42.... :D

Page 5 has some good picts too......
Dave's ground breaking news. (http://www.diyaquaponics.com/forum/showthread.php?224-Dave-s-ground-breaking-news/page4)

[Hotrodmike]

Wood works and a lot of koi guys use it either like Dave or 4x4 treated stacked and pinned ,look on Utube . You also may want to sink it part way in the ground for the thermal mass or berm up the sides to help out the insulation .
Have A Kind Day
Mike

[mommyhen42]

I was thinking more like a chest with a partially solid lid with a growbed on top and a hinged access lid all the way accross, maby with some sort of lighting for when I open the lid I could set it up with a pressure switch like you have in the fridge so that he light only comes on when you open the door.
Right now I have cement trays for my growbeds but I know that they are too shallow for most plants so what depth have you found to work best for your growbeds?

Autosiphons are a real pain for me to get working correctly. Does anyone have any ideas on how to properly calculate how to make them? I have loop siphons on most everything right now but they are a real pain to keep clear and not clog up, at least how I seem to have them

For instance if the grow bed frame is 10 inches deep and the gravel is say 8 inches deep will a 1/2 inch drain pipe work and if so how tall for the drain and what size pipe and length would you use for the autosiphon? Where would you set the vent hole and what size tubing for the vent? I just cant seem to get them to work right. Does pump volume affect your autosiphons and if so how do you calculate for it?

[stucco]

I don’t have much experience with loops, but they do seem tricky. Another option is a stand pipe with a small hole and a timer too fill the beds.

[badflash]

Bell siphons are easy as pie. Check my greenhouse build and you'll see. My 1" standpipe with the 2" cap drains at around 20 GPM with a 6" drop. It kicks with flow rates as low as .5 GPM. The key is to slope the drain pipe up just a bit so that it is full before the system starts to drain. With a 1" drain going to a 2" common pipe it only needs to slope up about 1" from the low point.

[Brier]

I don’t have much experience with loops, but they do seem tricky. Another option is a stand pipe with a small hole and a timer too fill the beds.
This is a good alternative, and is what is commonly used in hydroponics. When the pump kicks on it fills up to the level of the stand pipe, and when the pump kicks off, the water back flows out of the pump back into the sump. This system, although not what I am using( I just think bell siphons are too cool not to use) seems less prone to problems from variable flow, roots, and whatnot. I can't think of many reasons not too use this set up other than the added cost of a timer, which is minimal. Might even save money in the long run, because the pump is not constantly running. Wonder if the on/off cycle shortens pump life.

So many people use bell siphons, is there a reason that they are superior to this system, or do people just use them because the are pretty darn cool?

[badflash]

You have to sit back and admire the simplicity of a bell siphon. I can sit on my deck and listen to the darn things from my deck. It is way too cool. I was put off by them until I built my first one. After that I watched for hours not believing they could be some simple to make.

Cycling pumps on & off shortens their life decidedly. Nearly all of the wear & tear on pumps is in the windings and this all happens when they switch on. It saves power for sure, but keep some pumps in reserve and do a cost analysis on the replacement cost of the pump vs. the power cost over time. I'm voting for these crazy cheap intex pumps. 80 watts at $35 delivered for a new pump. Free on freecycle to the quick. At 10 cents a KW hour 24 hour a day operation for a year is $70. I have no idea what cycling these on & off will cost them in life, but I think the overall simplicty of the bell siphon wins.

[mommyhen42]

Yes I have found that continual on off cycles on a pump does shorten it's lifetime dramatically and can even cause impeller damage from the sudden starts and stops.

I think the bell siphons are really cool too but have had poor luck getting them to work consistently or even at all.

I will try the angle in the standpipe and see how that works. The loop siphons work pretty well but have a problem with easy clogging from roots or just plain ole gunk...

I think my problem with the auto siphon is that I do not have a full understanding on the parameters necessary to make it run correctly. Either I dont seem to get the siphon hose correct or perhaps the bell is too narrow or high?? Lets say I have a growbed that is a foot deep, I am assuming that I would not want the water to go any higher than 9-10 inches, I would guess that the standpipe would be at that level but if I use a 1/2 inch standpipe, what size pipe should I use for the siphon? How about placement of the siphon tube and it's length?

[badflash]

Check my greenhouse build in backyard systems. I show how I built mine. Really easy. Bulkhead fitting, 1" pipe, 2" pipe, end cap, and 1/4" aquarium tubing. Mine will kick with flow as low as 1/2 gallon per minute. The drain line needs about a 1" upward slope before it goes into the main drain header. This makes sure the siphon kicks on.

[mommyhen42]

Thanks Badflash I can always count on you to help make things easier to understand.
I really appreciate your help

[mommyhen42]

well the wooden tank is finally finished, all that is really left is to place a few more humidity vent holes and eventually paint the wood.
The whole thing calculated out to 230 gallons counting the raft bed on top

http://socalaquaponics.com/mypics/PICT00101.jpg
http://socalaquaponics.com/mypics/PICT00081.jpg

I am still rearranging things to my liking but for now it is up and running and also f&d to 3 gravel beds from the previous setup and that drains into a 30 gal fishtank with float rafts and pumped back to the raft tank on top of the big tank.

I bought an oiless compressor from harbor freight for $40 to run the O2 in there so that if we have a power failure there will be oxygen to the tank. The compressor tank is only 3 gal but I intend to purchase an aux tank for it later.