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Aquamon
08-09-2010, 01:51 PM
I swang into my local Harvest Moon (Hydro Store) to talk to the ever knowledgeable owner. This guy has been around the block. He has stories about teaching and writing curriculum on aquaponics and what not but said that he stopped doing it because of the growth rates. He said that they were far too slow. I am going to have to run light over my plants instead of the sun. If I'm doing this and the growth rates are too low it might not be worth it for me.

Has aquaponics changed a lot in the past several years that would allow the growth rates to greatly improve or is what he saying true?

Hotrodmike
08-09-2010, 02:57 PM
Welcome aboard
First off there are a whole lot of self proclaimed experts and if it works so poorly why are some of the major produce farms using hydroponics and aquaponics . Most Hydro shops really have no intrest in this due to sales and their trays are to shallow and you will not run back every week to buy more nutes as that is the real differance in hydro vs AP is where the nutes come from , fish or a bottle and nute tanks are too small for fish .
As for lighting the sun has seemed to work as well as any HPS light I know ,hmmmmmm they all say they copy the sun ! Now if you plan to grow year round then yes you will need some make up light in the winter to keep growth at maximum .
If he is such an expert why don't you invite him to come join us ,I mean gee maybe we all are just nuts :lol: Maybe he can explain his insite .
Have A Kind Day
Mike

dufflight
08-09-2010, 03:13 PM
From what I've seen a mature AP system out performs most hydro systems. And its a lot easier to just feed the fish and not have to worry about how fresh the hydro mix is. A commercial system is a bit different but they seem to be looking more into using fish. My last AP tomatoes when I pulled out the plants the chooks got more tomatoes than the last lof of hydro plants produced in a season.

JCO
08-09-2010, 07:04 PM
Welcome to the show....pull up an easy chair, relax and stay awhile. New voices are always a welcome addition to our family..! Whatever questions you have on you mind, this is the place to get the answers.

As for which is best, it has a lot to do with the farmer. Badflash says the best fertilizer is the farmer's shadow and I agree with him. No matter which way you go, it's going to require your attention to detail. Aquaponics isn't rocket science but it does require a good knowledge of what works and what doesn't.

Please go to your profile and put in where you are from. More than likely there are people close by.:mrgreen:

Aquamon
08-10-2010, 08:42 AM
I updated my profile with the bit of information.

My largest interest is the fish. I want to have edible fish coming out of my system. My reason for mentioning the lights is that I do not get sun at my house. I'm practically in the middle of the woods. So I will need to use HPS. I posed the question because I didn't want to be wasting the amount of energy and costs of the light if the grow was going to go slowly but from the sounds of it it'll be just fine.

They guy I mentioned did also say that they are rewriting the book on aquaponics compared to when he was last involved in it. So things probably aren't as he remembers.

badflash
08-10-2010, 08:43 AM
I don't do hydroponics because the fish grow so slow :mrgreen:

You can set to good levels of nutrients for rapid plant growth with the correct balance between fish and plants. For fish with lower metabolism, you may need more fish, that is all. There is also a nutrient adjustment using organic additives like wood ashes or blood meal in small amounts. A system always needs tweeking.

You don't need HPS or the power is uses. I use stock shop lights with cheap daylight bulbs. You can stand them up rather than hang them for tall plants. 80 watts covers a 2' X 4' area for $15.

dufflight
08-10-2010, 03:30 PM
If the fish are the main interest you might try growing duckweed instead of vegies. Use a lot less light and it can be used as a fish feed. You can still grow salad greens as well. Most systems can be tailored to your needs.

badflash
08-10-2010, 05:35 PM
Without grow beds, you'll need to do water changes and have a bio filter. Having a bed gives you free food and keeps the fish happy. Any food from the bed is a freebie. About 250 watts of FL daylight 12 hours a day is all you need. That ends up being about 30 cents a day in power.

Aquamon
08-11-2010, 06:12 AM
Nice BadFlash.

Well, I figure because of the amount of fish I want to house (Not decided yet but I know it will be too much for my system) I was thinking of using two 6x3 botanicare flood tables filled with hydroton. For ease of water changes I think having the tank in the basement would be good and I could just drain it into the wash basin. The grow beds could go in the room directly above the sump on the first floor. I can fit the two tables in there with some t5 lights. The overflow would dump through the floor and into a bio filter that could run from the ceiling to the tank. It all sounds good.

JCO
08-11-2010, 06:30 AM
Your Bio-filter should between the FT and the beds to change the ammonia to nitrites then to nitrates and then pumped to the beds to feed the plants.

If you have all the parts, it should go like this....FT to the SUMP to collect the solids...to the BIO-FILTER to change the ammonia to nitrites then to nitrates...to the GBs to feed the plants and then back to the fish clean of all ammonia, nitrites and nitrates.

Some people combine the SUMP and BIO-FILTER as one unit, but I have found separation of the two will help prevent 99% of the solids from finding their way into your GB and eventually clogging something somewhere and causing a mess that I prefer not to have to contend with. Finances usually dictates the system so you do with what you have and DIY. :mrgreen:

jackalope
08-11-2010, 09:28 AM
Welcome to the forum Aquamon, glad to have you here! Questions are always welcome, don't be too skeeered to ask, we don't bite (well, maybe one or two of us, but not all of us :lol: :lol: ) We love questions, and we especially love photos ;) Please be sure to put where you live in your profile so we know what part of the country/hemisphere/planet you are in ..... someone who lives nearby may be able to help you out personally as well.

We have a great FAQ (http://diyaquaponics.com/forum/faq.php) button for navigating the website controls, etc. at the top of the page, next to the "Members" button, please check it out if you haven't already done so.
We also have another FAQ (http://diyaquaponics.com/forum/viewforum.php?f=93) section which contains many of the hints and tips that have been collected along the way ..........
Before posting any URLs or emails, please take a look at the Forum Rules (http://diyaquaponics.com/forum/viewforum.php?f=103) .....
If you see something that you would like added to these FAQs, please let a moderator or admin know, and we'll discuss it and possibly add it to the list!

BTW, we have a special section for off-topic conversations called "The Sump" (http://diyaquaponics.com/forum/viewforum.php?f=102) to hopefully avoid crapping threads and keeping things on topic ;)

Once again, WELCOME TO THE FORUM :!: :!:

jackalope
08-11-2010, 01:31 PM
The big difference for me is the purchase/use of the nutrients, which someone has already mentioned. Note that in some jurisdictions, the spent water from Hydroponics is now considered toxic waste, so you may have to contend with that ..... be sure to check in with the state/county/city versions of the EPA before you make your decision ..... it could be expensive, especially if there are inspections and/or permits required, and you know they just love to levy fines and force you to tear out all of your hard work if you didn't have adequate permits to expel that toxic waste! Aquaponics, on the other hand, is a closed loop system, where you won't be putting any toxic waste onto the ground or into the sewer system (under normal circumstances). Aquaponics water is just dirty fish water as far as the EPAs are concerened, just as if you were dumping out your aquarium water from your goldfish bowl! Aquaponics gives you two crops, not one .... Food and fish! ..... once you're all set up, basically your only expenses are power and the fish food! Note that the only thing I'm considering is for home consumption, I can't say the same for commercial , because there are a lot of other factors that have to be taken into consideration and analyzed prior to entering into a business venture.

rfeiller
09-26-2010, 08:13 AM
there are a number of edible plants and many ornamental plants that do not want a lot of light, but would bring another dimension to your aquaponics, a number of them are considered tropical. they would take care of your water purification needs. philodendrons are a plant i have used when i had my commercial tropical fish hatchery to perform the task of removing the nitrates. since they are a vine they do well cramped and they develope a large root mass, don't need any rooting media, and produce attractive foliage. just make sure the plants themselves are not toxic. if you have the room taro (sometimes called elephant ears) does a great job at that process. just a thought.

dufflight
09-27-2010, 03:50 PM
If you want the GB's on the next floor then a tall tank may help. The taller the tank the less head the pump has to pump to.

Aquamon
09-28-2010, 05:28 AM
I think the head loss is something I've accepted.

I have recently built a room in my basement for my project equipment and may use half of that for an aquaponics setup. I've got too much going on to focus though.

Thanks for the replies because it draws me back to this site with the email notifications.

urbanfarmer
10-12-2010, 10:28 PM
I just wanted to say HELLO!

I have found this forum to be a cornucopia of knowledge. The members here are friendly and wise! Your stay will be a pleasant one, WELCOME.

The typical backyard gardener should see similar growth as traditional geoponic (in the soil) horticulture. You should give it a try, it's very fun and rewarding! :mrgreen: