Essential Plant Nutrients

[urbanfarmer]

Essential Plant Nutrients
http://www.ncagr.gov/agronomi/pdffiles/essnutr.pdf

[urbanfarmer]

The information on Wikipedia is WRONG: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Plant_nutrition

There are 17 essential plant nutrients, but Wikipedia lists some incorrect essential plant nutrients. Albeit, they are plant nutrients, but they are NOT essential to the vast majority of plants in general.

Also, the document I just linked all of you is missing Nickel (everything else is correct), which is the 17th essential plant nutrient that modern science has recently added and agreed to.

[urbanfarmer]

This is made for kids, but it's so clear and easy to read I want to include it here: http://www.ncagr.gov/cyber/kidswrld/plant/nutrient.htm

It also leaves out Nickel.

[Bioritize]

Do you have any recommendations of how to add some of those nutrients to the system?

What about natural vitamin supplements like Body Balance, it claims to have tons of trace minerals and nutrients.

[urbanfarmer]

Do you have any recommendations of how to add some of those nutrients to the system?
There are lots of ways. Some easy examples are putting things like a simple eggshell or oyster shell for calcium, banana peels for potassium, etc. Tap water/well water often has a lot of minerals in it already. Compost or worm casting tea can work quite well too. We have a member on here that has a hybrid system with the worm poop built into his aquaponics! :mrgreen:


What about natural vitamin supplements like Body Balance, it claims to have tons of trace minerals and nutrients.
It depends what form it's already in. If you read me the ingredients from the label I can give it a shot. That's not the most cost effective way to do it though. Water soluble fertilizers are much cheaper.

[Bioritize]

http://www.lifeforce.net/pdfs/datasheets/usa/body_balance_1.pdf

Here is the stuff, it is in liquid form. I have been taking this stuff for a few years now and I really notice a difference in my overall health. I wondered if I could add this to my tank? It is mostly sea vegetables and aloe. How would I test the PH of this solution, it is very dark.

I plan to add worms into the grow beds once my beds age a bit.

[urbanfarmer]

http://www.lifeforce.net/pdfs/datasheets/usa/body_balance_1.pdf

Here is the stuff, it is in liquid form. I have been taking this stuff for a few years now and I really notice a difference in my overall health. I wondered if I could add this to my tank? It is mostly sea vegetables and aloe. How would I test the PH of this solution, it is very dark.

I plan to add worms into the grow beds once my beds age a bit.
No wonder. That stuff has all kinds of bad stuff in it including toxins and radioactive chemicals. California company? Explains a lot. You have to be high to come up with this concept... Anyway, the nutrients were added to the mix in organic substances. Chances are at least half that stuff should be available and if not it will become available eventually to the plants. But Jesus... some of the things in it are radioactive, inorganic toxins, and even organic toxins (like one prevents protein uptake in mammals). What the hell is that stuff??? You don't have to be a chemist to know DON'T DRINK LEAD, ARSENIC, CADMIUM, OR COBALT. Cyanidin is a cyanide compound... I mean I could go on and on, and maybe some stuff genuinely could be good in small enough quantities WHO KNOWS, but I doubt it...

So as not to freak you out completely, understand we drink these substances on a daily basis. Our bodies can remove it from our system at certain concentrations, and in fact it does. The average human being's urine contains arsenic for example. I'd bet you can't find ONE person who doesn't regularly excrete this at low concentrations. Tap and bottle water has these things (except RO in theory). Anyway, don't freak out, but I sure hope you didn't waste much money my friend! :(

The pH of the water will still show up in a small pH test tube. Once it gets in the small tube it won't be nearly as dark. If it's really really dark you can always try to settle out some of the stuff making it dark. Maybe let it sit a while or refrigerate it. I had some very dark water in a small aquarium and the pH tests showed up fine.

[Bioritize]

How about rock dust for a way to add the essential minerals to your systems?

http://www.fertilizeronline.com/rockdust.php

[keith_r]

i wouldn't worry about adding "essential nutrients" unless your plants are showing a specific deficency (i think that's something else i agree on with uf! hehehe)

make sure you provide a quality fish food for your fish and you should be ok, and be able to target specific "problems" in your system when you have them

[urbanfarmer]

How about rock dust for a way to add the essential minerals to your systems?

http://www.fertilizeronline.com/rockdust.php
It's hard to say from what little info they have on their website about the product. If it's truly rock, that normally takes a long time in nature to break down. To make it plant available, it often requires the presence of elements that would likely kill your fish and plants. I'm not saying some of the stuff might not become available and quickly, but some of it definitely shouldn't if it's rock. Also, we don't know what else is in there (it mentions 56 unknown elements).

Personally, I wouldn't use it. We need to know what's in it before we throw it into our little ecosystem. :cry:


i wouldn't worry about adding "essential nutrients" unless your plants are showing a specific deficency (i think that's something else i agree on with uf! hehehe)

make sure you provide a quality fish food for your fish and you should be ok, and be able to target specific "problems" in your system when you have them
YES! :mrgreen:

[davidstcldfl]

To make it plant available, it often requires the presence of elements that would likely kill your fish and plants. I'm not saying some of the stuff might not become available and quickly, but some of it definitely shouldn't if it's rock.
They wrote....
Rock dust is of course, inorganic. And since microbes consume the fine dust easily, they then discharge organically available plant food. The warmer the climate, the more microbes that are available to create plant food.

I think your correct UF...it may take some time. Even though they seem to grind it pretty fine. Fine enough to go through a sprayer.




Also, we don't know what else is in there (it mentions 56 unknown elements).

Personally, I wouldn't use it. We need to know what's in it before we throw it into our little ecosystem.
They wrote...
Agrowinn-Minerals (Rock Dust) have an extraordinarily high level of minerals and trace elements (57 different trace elements) in well balanced quantities. (Contact us for a complete trace element list).

UF, you didn't ask for the list..?
A great researcher would never draw conclussions with out the facts.. :D

There must be no barriers to freedom of inquiry ... There is no place for dogma in science. The scientist is free, and must be free to ask any question, to doubt any assertion, to seek for any evidence, to correct any errors. - Robert Oppenheimer, 1949

[urbanfarmer]

To make it plant available, it often requires the presence of elements that would likely kill your fish and plants. I'm not saying some of the stuff might not become available and quickly, but some of it definitely shouldn't if it's rock.
They wrote....
Rock dust is of course, inorganic. And since microbes consume the fine dust easily, they then discharge organically available plant food. The warmer the climate, the more microbes that are available to create plant food.

I think your correct UF...it may take some time. Even though they seem to grind it pretty fine. Fine enough to go through a sprayer.




Also, we don't know what else is in there (it mentions 56 unknown elements).

Personally, I wouldn't use it. We need to know what's in it before we throw it into our little ecosystem.
They wrote...
Agrowinn-Minerals (Rock Dust) have an extraordinarily high level of minerals and trace elements (57 different trace elements) in well balanced quantities. (Contact us for a complete trace element list).

UF, you didn't ask for the list..?
A great researcher would never draw conclussions with out the facts.. :D

There must be no barriers to freedom of inquiry ... There is no place for dogma in science. The scientist is free, and must be free to ask any question, to doubt any assertion, to seek for any evidence, to correct any errors. - Robert Oppenheimer, 1949
The surface area of the particle changes relevant to the radius by a power of 3. Bacteria require the surface area to be efficient at consuming the minerals. Assuming the dust is say 2mm vs. 0.1 micro meter the surface area would be off by a factor of 8,000,000,000,000 (and that's assuming a sphere). It might seem close, but it's not even close. Just imagine how long that would take if the decomposition rate of the mineral rock is a function of the surface area... JUST IMAGINE!

As far as asking for the list, there's no need. Given the limited number of elements on the periodic table, it can be logically deduced that there are several toxic elements included. Whether the concentration is low or not for 1 dosage, it will accumulate in the system. I still wouldn't do it! I can "show my work" if you want! :mrgreen:

[Oliver]

UF,

Congratulations, you are now tied for first place in the number of post at 1463.

Oliver

[urbanfarmer]

UF,

Congratulations, you are now tied for first place in the number of post at 1463.

Oliver
Thank you, and WOW! I really am on here too much! :lol:

It helps a lot though. Sometimes people challenge me to learn more or sometimes I have to learn more to give people a full answer. I honestly wouldn't know so much about certain aspects of aquaponics if it wasn't for this community! :mrgreen:

[davidstcldfl]

UF,

Congratulations, you are now tied for first place in the number of post at 1463.

Oliver
Thank you, and WOW! I really am on here too much! :lol:

It helps a lot though. Sometimes people challenge me to learn more or sometimes I have to learn more to give people a full answer. I honestly wouldn't know so much about certain aspects of aquaponics if it wasn't for this community! :mrgreen:
Wow , cool UF... :D

I have to confess, I have fun razzing you.. :P .... or yanking on your chain... :lol: I hope it does give you a chance to learn more... :D ...and in turn, we learn more from you.
Thanks again for being such a good sport UF !

Speaking of razzing you....in your above math problem....you went against Mr. Oppenheimer's advice, and 'assumed' the dust was 2 mm.
Their dust goes through a 2500 screen mesh, which means the particles should only be .005 mm, not the boulder size you used .
Could you please re-work your math ? :P ... :lol:

[urbanfarmer]

UF,

Congratulations, you are now tied for first place in the number of post at 1463.

Oliver
Thank you, and WOW! I really am on here too much! :lol:

It helps a lot though. Sometimes people challenge me to learn more or sometimes I have to learn more to give people a full answer. I honestly wouldn't know so much about certain aspects of aquaponics if it wasn't for this community! :mrgreen:
Wow , cool UF... :D

I have to confess, I have fun razzing you.. :P .... or yanking on your chain... :lol: I hope it does give you a chance to learn more... :D ...and in turn, we learn more from you.
Thanks again for being such a good sport UF !

Speaking of razzing you....in your above math problem....you went against Mr. Oppenheimer's advice, and 'assumed' the dust was 2 mm.
Their dust goes through a 2500 screen mesh, which means the particles should only be .005 mm, not the boulder size you used .
Could you please re-work your math ? :P ... :lol:
Hm... good point. To do the right math I would actually have to know the size the bacteria needs or at least get some data on what sizes react how, but I was just pointing out the difference of power and its effect on the dust in systems. That is very small dust though. Even assuming it reacts fast enough, then you have to consider so many other factors...